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"the claimant has actually paid Class 1 or Class 2 contributions in respect of one of the last [F2two] complete tax years (“the base tax year”) before the beginning of the relevant benefit year,"

Thank you both.

I have looked at the legislation & I suppose it can be confusing.
As it refers to the relevant benefit year.
So Tamara is saying that the relevant year is the one before the award of the LCWRA
& Gordon points out that the relevant year is the one before the potential new claim.

I am very grateful for any guidance.

When I spoke to Welfare Rights they suggested that the applicant make a claim for NS ESA & let the DWP decide on the eligibility, as I was not sure, at the time, of the applicants NI record. But, they have since said that the claimant would not be eligible if the last NI contributions would have been in January 2022.

I have now advised the applicant of this.

It is a shame that there is no scope within UC for a contribution based reward.

Thank you again.

TC

I am sorry but your information is incorrect.

The Tax years to be used for a claim of NS ESA are set by the date of the claim, for a claim made today they are, as previously stated 2021-22 and 2022-23. The person has only a partial year of NI Credits or Contributions in the Tax Year 22-23 and so does not meet the criteria.

Their having LCWRA under UC is irrelevant as the payment of NS ESA is predicated on the claimant meeting the two Contribution Conditions, which they do not. At best, they would qualify for the payment of Class 1 NI Credits, however, this would restrict their working hours and income for the following years due to the Permitted Work limits.

Gordon

JJ

Voluntary Contributions only count towards the State Pension, not NS ESA.

I can't give you a definitive answer for their working especially if it is self-employment but there are minimums comes that have to be met to receive NI Credits and higher ones for NI Contributions. The following page has the amounts.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/rates...urance-contributions

Providing the minimums are met then they should be OK to claim NS ESA.

Gordon

JJ

The current Tax Years being used for NS ESA are 2021-22 and 2022-23 so if the person stopped making NI Contributions in January 2022 then they will not meet the Contribution Conditions.

If they started making the payments again through work then my rough calculation is that they would not be able to claim NS ESA until January 2028 using the Tax Years 2025-26 and 2026-27.

Gordon

Thank you.

So any qualification for NS ESA would effectively mean the applicant re-commencing NI contributions & keeping these up for 2 years. ?
Could I ask please , would they be able to do this through the permitted work they do within their current UC entitlement ? (their permitted work is on a self employment basis).

Or would they need to go back to work full time ?

Thank you for your help.

Hi
I understand that a claimant must have 2 out of the last 3 years of working NI contributions before they become eligible for NS ESA.
So if an applicant ceased paying NI contributions in January 2022 then I take it they would not be eligible ?
I get confused with the financial years.
Thank you.

Hi,

I found recently, to my great happiness, I could cope with a bit of part-time driving work, but am finding extreme difficulty in getting any shifts given to me through my temp agencies. So through other sources, i.e. gig and part-time permanent or contract work, it's extremely hard to find stuff that's consistently within the earnings limits: most proper employers pay above minimum wage now. And some gig ones have funny hours/pay patterns. This is also material for a friend on PIP and ESA-LCWRA who through nominal self-employment has occasionally exceeded hours/earnings limits (under her interpretation of the rules). So:


Pension contributions and net earnings

Can pension contributions reduce employed earnings prior to the £183.50 (min wage x 16hrs) assessment being applied for ESA exempt ('permitted') work purposes, in the way it does for income tax, i.e. it reducing the pre-income-tax income by 50% of the amount contributed?


Pension contribs and gig work/self-employed net earnings

If so could pension contributions achieve a similar result in the case of nominally self-employed gig work, through ad-hoc contributions?


Pension contribs and employers refusing to operate pension schemes

Where an employer refuses to operate a pension scheme, can I reduce my nominal earnings for ESA purposes by making ad-hoc contributions?



Statutory holiday pay, minimum wage, and the moment at which the holiday pay is deemed to have been earned

Given for income tax purposes statutory holiday pay must (surely?) be deemed to be earned in the week in which the employee elects for it to be taken, and given some employers are entitled to pay it at the same time as the wage (as long as it’s itemized), do those latter (immediate) payments a) get treated as not immediate earnings for tax purposes and b) for ESA purposes?


Statutory holiday pay, minimum wage, and self-employment (as matter of statutory interpretation)

and given as a matter of policy & statutory interpretation it’s unrealistic to presume self-employed workers don’t need/won’t take holidays, can an analogous ‘holiday apportionment’ be applied to self-employed earners’ incomes, to raise the weekly £183.50 cap by the statutory holiday minimum of 12.07%, i.e. to £205.65 (so long as the earner takes 5.6 weeks’ holiday, or less on a pro-rata basis)?


Unpaid travel time between piecework jobs, and 16 hour limit

Does unpaid travel time on public transport between piecework gig (car delivery) jobs in a several-delivery day count as work hours?


Point at which the week begins for purposes of 16 hour limit

If a gig ‘employer’ (in fact they declare it’s self-employment’) only offers a minimum of 3-day tranches of work, paid by cars delivered (3-4 deliveries a day, £20-£28 a delivery, they estimate £80 income a day, although some online report as little as £40-50, they estimate taking 8-10 hours to perform), could someone in my shoes with a 16 hour limit (18 with averaging) declare my week-beginning to be after one of those 3 days, and do one 3-day tranche every two weeks instead of every one week, ergo on one ‘week’ I do 1 shift and on another ‘week’ I do two?


New PW1 form for each new work pattern?

Do I need to submit a new PW1 form for every new employer (or gigwork organizer) given each will have a slightly different work-pattern, pay, and set of duties?


Can one begin work if technically uncertain but has at least arguable case about PW1 (permitted/exempt work terms) compliance?

If I’m worried that a ‘no’ answer might be forthcoming to one of the above questions arising from a PW1 submission, but that a ‘yes’ is crucial to it falling within permitted work rules, does that mean I can/can’t begin the work but submit a PW1 immediately if I’m to keep my ESA, or is it OK to begin the work, submit PW1 immediately, and then stop it if ESA say it doesn’t fall within the rules?


I truly despair of getting any other work I can do with my current training and experience and capability level, and these questions and similar have become crucial, both for me and a friend in a similar position.

With enormous thanks - Jonathan

Many thanks for the clarification on this.

Nothing has been mentioned online for this scenario yet. Doesn’t New Style esa require enough ni contributions to qualify ?, I think legacy esa cb provides class 1 ni credits?, so no panic as in regards to not being able to receive New Style esa. (Automatically qualify?). The applicable payment for housing costs (rent) on UC would still be included?.

bm

You don't need to make multiple posts, all new posts go into a holding area until they are moved into the forum by a Moderator.

As to making late NI Contributions, have a look at the following

www.moneysavingexpert.com/savings/volunt...nsion%20More%20items

www.gov.uk/voluntary-national-insurance-contributions/deadlines

Gordon

Thank you Gordon, (its not my real name shown thank you for the kind alert) just to say what I meant was I am Currently receiving IR ESA as well as Pip, I was advised that with managed migration, with no break in claim, the error of law back payment would remain disregarded capital , however when I transfer to uc is there any way paying NI missing contributions for my wife could be seen as deprivation of capital ? after all in the long run it means my wife won't have to claim benefits for not having full NI years?

Thank you

Gordon,

I'm on CB ESA (Support Group). I'm not entitled to any income-related benefit. I'm terrified reading this thread. Will I be migrated to New Style ESA this year? Will I be reassessed? Am I even entitled? I've been disabled for most of my life with very few voluntary contributions only NI Credits from SDA and past IR ESA. If PIP ceases to be a cash payment I might be without any income.

Thanks, MW

Am on contributions esa,pip ,support group ,will I be changed to another group when my award finishes, am confused on what's happening, any advice ,would be much appreciated thank you

I receive contributions based ESA. The amount I receive is reduced because I get two ill health pensions (both from the same scheme). I have been in this position since 2016. Everything ran okay until last autumn when payments were missing or days late. When I spoke to ESA they told me this was because there was too much information on my file and some needed to be archived.

My second payment in January came in at an increased amount. I phoned ESA to query this and was told it was correct. Still concerned about an overpayment I wrote a letter to them and posted it on 2 February. The amounts continued to come in too high. Then in April, this increased again due to the annual increase. I have not received my annual letter with a breakdown of the amount. I tried phoning in several times but couldn't get through. Eventually, I got through last week. I was told my letter was scanned onto the system but hadn't been actioned.

The lady on the phone told me:

It looked like only one pension had been included in the calculation.
The person doing the calculation was responsible for checking it was the same as my previous payment.
If I was underpaid before (I wasn't) I would have received backdated money.
It was a DWP error.
Someone would phone me within 72 hours to sort out the issue.

I haven't received a phone call. Should I write to them again to cover my back? I am worried after seeing the stories about carers being prosecuted for DWP errors.

Thanks for your help Gordon.

ESA would be more beneficial for me then.

Can I therefore withdraw my Universal Credit and simply stick to New Style ESA on its own?

I know that ESA is 'contribution based' - and I would meet that criteria has I have made the relevant contributions and have a full history since 1995 without any gaps.

My husband & I have always had a joint tax credit account & my contributions based ESA has always been included on the required info., but obviously I get my ESA straight from DWP into my own separate bank account.
We've now have had to fill in the universal credit application & it's really confusing!
Would I be still ne able to keep claiming my ESA instead of including it on the claim?
It seems almost as if we've had to claim for each other..
I couldn't confirm my identity bcs I surrendered
my driving licence for
medical reasons & it hasn't
been returned yet & i have
none of the others.
I had an email that they'll call me, but it says on my husband's to do list that they'll call him about it.
I'm so confused & stressed.
Sorry this is so long

VIA wrote:

If you click on my name on this forum, kindly note I am just a member of this forum and not a moderator, but I posted a few very extensive posts going into details on how you can get evidence from this online record with your GP and giving you examples of what you can see.

Jumping to object to the possible sentiment that members have less to offer than mods. That is so not true! I am sure that the experience of the body of members here is far greater than that of all the mods put together. It is possible that mods might know more bits of technical stuff, but very often there is nothing to beat practical first hand experience and we value everyone's contributions!

Thank you for your contributions to this site and our community!
Catherine

Hello

Due to transition from tax credits to universal credit on 20th May; am self employed. I am assuming DWP will look at my income , expenses, pension contributions from 20th May, monthly Does anyone know if this is correct? I receive a tax credit payment a few days beforehand. I am understanding the two to be separate.
Needing clarification of above to work out timing of money I pay into pension from earnings, minus expenses.
Also does anyone know UC amount that is relevent to get support with NHS dental treatment

Thank you for your help

Jane

Thank you Gordon. Yes I am claiming New Style Contributions Based ESA. I’m still a bit confused though! Are you saying that if I am placed in the LCWRA group my contributions based ESA will continue indefinitely ? And if not it will continue for 12 months only.
I’m assuming that getting enhanced daily living on PIP makes no difference to that LCWRA decision, I could still be considered fit for work and in order to claim any disability premium I would need to claim UC as well? If UC is means tested I definitely won’t be entitled to anything . Just wanted to say thank you for all the support and help on this site, I used your guide to apply for PIP . I was awarded it without any lengthy assessments, just a 20 minute phone call out of the blue from the DWP . Very relieved and grateful. I have never claimed anything before, the guidance on this site made the process much easier. Many thanks

M.

It sounds like they are applying the national rules for social care support in a residential setting. That allows them to take anything above the personal expenses allowance of £28.25 per week ( soon to rise to 30.15 ). The rules are different in community settings, so if he comes home during college holidays the community rules should apply.